I am waiting for parts to come in but this weekend I will be starting the F100. I am pretty confident the solenoid will do the job because I was able to get it to turn by bypassing the solenoid.
So this weekend I am planning on doing the next updates:
1. Replace solenoid
2. Replace spark plugs
3. Fix all the wiring related to the starter and the battery.
4. Secure the coil
More updates soon.
Thursday, May 30, 2013
Tuesday, May 28, 2013
Troubleshooting the Starter
The driver kept coming off. I noticed from other websites that what I thought is two parts is actually one. Therefore I took it upon my self to weld them together. This experiment was actually successful. I put it back together and as stated above it fired for three four times and then got stuck.
Original 6V starter
Removed the starter again.
After removing it I found out the safety pin holding the spring together came off. I was lucky to pull the whole assembly out without loosing any parts inside the flywheel hole.
Removed the starter again.
After removing it I found out the safety pin holding the spring together came off. I was lucky to pull the whole assembly out without loosing any parts inside the flywheel hole.
showing the original spring -- half busted
Step two
So I went for a search of a pin. Two auto parts places and a home depot later -- and a total of $3.00 cost plus a monster truck for my son for $5.99
I tried "bench testing" the started with a 20A 6V power supply and no sign of kicking the gear. I did a bit more research to find out the starter actually draws about 10 times more power. Something like 1.2KW not 120W.
So I went ahead and put it on the vehicle again for the fourth time. I am getting good at this let me tell you. I secured all the cables with much confidence that everything is ready to go.
... Not so fast cowboy. Not suck luck. Now I can only hear a clicking sound coming from the solenoid.
I ordered a new solenoid today for $12.00 but just to gain more confidence I just overwrote the solenoid (by bypassing it) and the starter sounds good. Yeah... Now I am waiting for the new solenoid so I can move on with this thing..
I ordered a new solenoid today for $12.00 but just to gain more confidence I just overwrote the solenoid (by bypassing it) and the starter sounds good. Yeah... Now I am waiting for the new solenoid so I can move on with this thing.. I will post again when I receive it in.
Thursday, May 23, 2013
1955 Ford F100 Truck restoration project started when my uncle Henry James Hall gave me the nicest gift ever!!
Posted: 05/23/2013
The action plan is:
1. Fix the driver door latch: I have already done this. I will post a picture tomorrow
2. Fix the Starting motor to get it running. Target completion 05/27/13 (memorial weekend)
3. Start fixing the body -- Look at the rear fender:
6. Replace the windshield and the broken driver window
Listing a few other pictures here to document the truck's restoration process!!
7. The interior is also in poor condition!! Needs much TLC..
The vehicle is a stick shift Three speed:
"Three on the Tree"
Posted on 05/24/2013 by Sophronis Mantoles
Here is a quick video from back in November of 2012 when we first got the truck running. After sitting for 20 years, we put fresh gas, a new battery, cleaned up the points and vala..
http://youtu.be/iSba6B6XUOg
Posted on 05/26/13 by Sophronis Mantoles
I fixed a couple of minor things over the weekend. Removed an old towing hitch and the front licence plate. I also took the starting motor off and found out that I need to do some work on it. I have to replace this component on it ( I am not sure what is called yet):
Here are a couple of pictures:
Before 
After
I also found out that I will need to do something on the floor by the right door.
Here is a picture of the hinge I cut off:
posted on 05/26/13 by Sophronis Mantoles
After having troubles with my starting motor situation I started reading about it and came up with the following post on this web site:
http://en.allexperts.com/q/Classic-Antique-Car-2542/1955-Ford-F100.htm
Question
Hi Dick,
I am a little confused on this whole "positive ground" situation and it's getting deeper by the minute.
Background: A friend was temporarily storing this truck for someone and after driving it for a couple weeks the truck wouldn't crank. He replaced the battery with a new 6v battery from Napa #7204 and it drove for a couple more days until the truck wouldn't start again. I got involved to "help" and suggested the alt/gen was not charging properly.
I started out by getting a 6v charger and checking the terminals on the battery which appeared to be loose. My plan was to charge the battery and get it started to trouble shoot some more. So I put the charger on the battery as I typically would red to pos. and black to neg. and the charger would click on and off. I didn't think much of this because I have a few "micro processor" charger for 12v systems and the click on and off all the time. When I went back the next day the truck was still dead. Starter would just click. So I checked all the basic electrical stuff like start button, starter solenoid and starter for corrosion. Everything looked ok. Next, I put my volt meter on the battery, with cables attached, and it read less than 1 volt! Obviously not enough juice to do anything. So I figured the battery was bad. Upon removing the battery cables, and checking the voltage without the cables attached, it spiked up to 2.15 volts. So I think I'm on to something. My thought was that the cables were crossed on the battery (i.e. the chassis ground was connected to the pos. terminal) which would allow the charger to work. So I charged the battery over night, with the cables disconnected, and it took a full charge. So, I put a negative battery terminal cable on and attach it to the chassis and then connect the positive wire to the positive on the battery. I go to start the truck and it was cranking enough to build oil pressure but didn't fire. Not knowing the vehicle, I began to check fuel supply and there was none. After putting 4 gallons of fuel in it fired right away and ran great.
With it running, I checked the voltage at the battery and it read 6.45 volts with only a little fluctuation.
NOW, this is my concern. Just tonight I'm hearing about a positive ground system and I HAVE NO CLUE what this means or if the truck is going to blow up...
Will you please provide me some insight? Is it a positive ground from the factory and how would I know if it has been converted to negative ground? What should I do next?
Thank You.
John
Dick
Answer
Step one is to immediately disconnect the battery, if you haven't already done so, because this situation can and will lead to an underhood fire if the battery was in backwards long enough to damage the voltage regulator.
On to diagnosis (and a little history): You are going to have to read this very carefully - do it step by step, and read all the way through it before you start. This is complicated and confusing, I know, but I don't know how to make it easy!
Many if not most of the vehicles built prior to 1956 were wired positive ground (because it is a better system). This includes all Ford, Chysler Corp and most "independent" products. GM was a notable exception, their vehicles were negative ground, which has now become the industry standard.
This means that the truck was originally hooked up with the + terminal of the battery connected to the chassis/engine ground, and the - terminal of the battery connected to the starter and every other electrical device on the truck via the appropriate switch or relay. The vehicle can be made to run either way, as long as the wiring is set up right and the generator and regulator are also set up for it.
We need to do some detective work to find out which way the truck is now set up to run (someone may have converted it to negative ground, is what I am saying, and we have to determine that).
I advise taking a step by step approach as follows:
1. Put the battery cables on the original way (+ to chassis, - to electrical items) but as you connect the last end of the second cable (which one doesn't matter) with everything turned off in the truck, check to see whether or not there is a spark as you tap the cable end to the connection. If you see a spark, don't connect it yet (we'll come back to this).
2. If there is no spark, go ahead and connect the cables and turn on the headlights - then go look at the ammeter (if the truck has one) and note whether it is reading a charge or a discharge. Probably it doesn't have one, so we'll have to find out another way, but if it does have one, this is the easy way. OR, if it has a voltmeter, see if it is reading below zero, or about right (6.5 volts). If it has no guages, post a "follow up question" to me and we'll find another way to do this.
If the gauge reads correctly ("discharge" from the headlight drain, or upscale on the voltage scale), go to step 3.
If the gauges read backwards (showing a "charge" when the headlights are on, (engine stopped), or showing a voltage less than zero), reverse the battery connections and go back to step 1, but with the battery now hooked up for negative ground ( - to chassis, and + to the electrical system). Then go to step 3.
3. Next, start the engine and monitor the battery voltage with your portable meter as you rev the engine to fast idle. If the charging system is OK, you will see a rising voltage as the generator replenishes the battery after the start - it will keep rising until it gets to about 7.2 volts, if everything is undamaged and hooked up correctly. If the voltage stays steady, and doesn't climb up toward 7.2 volts, the charging system is not working. The truck can still be driven this way during daylight hours, but you will have to "top up" the battery after every trip until you get the charging system repaired. Do NOT leave the vehicle with the battery hooked up, because a common failure mode for a damaged voltage regulator is to drain the battery through the generator windings, which can and often has resulted in the vehicle being destroyed by a nasty underhood fire.
As for what might be wrong with the charging system, that is another very long discussion - but let's get the polarity issue straightend out first, then tackle that issue, OK? My fingers are getting sore!
OK< all the way back to step 1: If, when you tapped the battery cable on the last connection there WAS a spark, do not connect the battery cables yet. Make very sure there is nothing on inside the truck (lights, radio, heater, anything at all). If not, then, find the voltage regulator and remove the wires from it, and tape the ends so they cannot touch anything. Do the same with the generator wires. Now tap the battery connection again - if there is still a spark, there is still something drawing current - look further until you find it, disconnecting things if you have to until there is no spark when you connect the cables. Once you get to that point, hook up the cables and do the tests of step 2 again. If the battery cable makes a spark when you tap it on the connection ONLY when the generator and voltage regulator are hooked up, there is a problem in the charging system, whether it is charging or not. Probably it is going to have to go to a generator shop for service, if you can find one in your area. Don't hook up the charging system in this condition - it could easily lead to an underhood fire. You can drive it that way, as long as you don't use the headlights or drive very far without recharging the battery.
Post a follow up report to me on what you learn from the above tests, and we'll take it the next mile.
Good luck!
After reading the post above I am starting to wonder if I have a similar problem. I have to check with the person who did the 12V conversion on the F100 to find out what they did. I will follow up with a posting here once I find out.
Posted on May 28th 2013
So I was able to continue troubleshooting. After fixing the starter drive (using my welder), I put the starter back on. It fired three to four times and then got stuck. I tried overwriting the solenoid (by bypassing it), no luck.
The driver kept coming off. I noticed from other websites that what I thought is two parts is actually one. Therefore I took it upon my self to weld them together. This experiment was actually successful. I put it back together and as stated above it fired for three four times and then got stuck.
Step two
Removed the starter again.
After removing it I found out the safety pin holding the spring together came off. I was lucky to pull the whole assembly out without loosing any parts inside the flywheel hole.
So I went for a search of a pin. Two auto parts places and a home depot later -- and a total of $3.00 cost plus a monster
truck for my son for $5.99
I tried "bench testing" the started with a 20A 6V power supply and no sign of kicking the gear. I did a bit more research to find out the starter actually draws about 10 times more power. Something like 1.2KW not 120W.
So I went ahead and put it on the vehicle again for the fourth time. I am getting good at this let me tell you. I secured all the cables with much confidence that everything is ready to go.
... Not so fast cowboy. Not suck luck. Now I can only hear a clicking sound coming from the solenoid.
I ordered a new solenoid today for $12.00 but just to gain more confidence I just overwrote the solenoid (by bypassing it) and the starter sounds good. Yeah... Now I am waiting for the new solenoid so I can move on with this thing.. I will post again when I receive it in.
 |
| Side view of the Truck |
A bit of Historical info:
The Truck was purchased in 1957 by Henry James Hall of Lutsen MN. My uncle Henry (goes by Jim) was the second owner of the truck. He used it on/off from 1957 through 1993 as a work truck.
Restoring the truck will be quite a bit of work. Been a work truck for a logger in the North woods it got a lot of abuse. Now it needs TLC ( a lot of it). I will keep posting updates on the work done on the truck periodically.
My initial plan is to get it running (mechanically reliable). My uncle put an electric fuel pump that I am considering replacing with a mechanical pump. The vehicle was also converted to a 12V system. The starting motor also gave up on us as we were unloading the vehicle from the Uhaull transponder.
The action plan is:
1. Fix the driver door latch: I have already done this. I will post a picture tomorrow
2. Fix the Starting motor to get it running. Target completion 05/27/13 (memorial weekend)
3. Start fixing the body -- Look at the rear fender:
 |
| Rear Right fender was damaged. Needs to be either fixed or replaced. |
4. Fix the wiring to the tail lights on the back. The existing wiring needs to be stripped out.
5. Fix the fenders:
6. Replace the windshield and the broken driver window
"Three on the Tree"
More updates coming soon. Write to blog if you have any ideas!!
posted 05/24/05 by Sophronis Mantoles
Here is some info on the Trucks from wikipedia:
Here is a quick video from back in November of 2012 when we first got the truck running. After sitting for 20 years, we put fresh gas, a new battery, cleaned up the points and vala..
http://youtu.be/iSba6B6XUOg
I fixed a couple of minor things over the weekend. Removed an old towing hitch and the front licence plate. I also took the starting motor off and found out that I need to do some work on it. I have to replace this component on it ( I am not sure what is called yet):
Here are a couple of pictures:
After
I also found out that I will need to do something on the floor by the right door.
Here is a picture of the hinge I cut off:
posted on 05/26/13 by Sophronis Mantoles
After having troubles with my starting motor situation I started reading about it and came up with the following post on this web site:
http://en.allexperts.com/q/Classic-Antique-Car-2542/1955-Ford-F100.htm
Question
Hi Dick,
I am a little confused on this whole "positive ground" situation and it's getting deeper by the minute.
Background: A friend was temporarily storing this truck for someone and after driving it for a couple weeks the truck wouldn't crank. He replaced the battery with a new 6v battery from Napa #7204 and it drove for a couple more days until the truck wouldn't start again. I got involved to "help" and suggested the alt/gen was not charging properly.
I started out by getting a 6v charger and checking the terminals on the battery which appeared to be loose. My plan was to charge the battery and get it started to trouble shoot some more. So I put the charger on the battery as I typically would red to pos. and black to neg. and the charger would click on and off. I didn't think much of this because I have a few "micro processor" charger for 12v systems and the click on and off all the time. When I went back the next day the truck was still dead. Starter would just click. So I checked all the basic electrical stuff like start button, starter solenoid and starter for corrosion. Everything looked ok. Next, I put my volt meter on the battery, with cables attached, and it read less than 1 volt! Obviously not enough juice to do anything. So I figured the battery was bad. Upon removing the battery cables, and checking the voltage without the cables attached, it spiked up to 2.15 volts. So I think I'm on to something. My thought was that the cables were crossed on the battery (i.e. the chassis ground was connected to the pos. terminal) which would allow the charger to work. So I charged the battery over night, with the cables disconnected, and it took a full charge. So, I put a negative battery terminal cable on and attach it to the chassis and then connect the positive wire to the positive on the battery. I go to start the truck and it was cranking enough to build oil pressure but didn't fire. Not knowing the vehicle, I began to check fuel supply and there was none. After putting 4 gallons of fuel in it fired right away and ran great.
With it running, I checked the voltage at the battery and it read 6.45 volts with only a little fluctuation.
NOW, this is my concern. Just tonight I'm hearing about a positive ground system and I HAVE NO CLUE what this means or if the truck is going to blow up...
Will you please provide me some insight? Is it a positive ground from the factory and how would I know if it has been converted to negative ground? What should I do next?
Thank You.
John
Dick
Answer
Step one is to immediately disconnect the battery, if you haven't already done so, because this situation can and will lead to an underhood fire if the battery was in backwards long enough to damage the voltage regulator.
On to diagnosis (and a little history): You are going to have to read this very carefully - do it step by step, and read all the way through it before you start. This is complicated and confusing, I know, but I don't know how to make it easy!
Many if not most of the vehicles built prior to 1956 were wired positive ground (because it is a better system). This includes all Ford, Chysler Corp and most "independent" products. GM was a notable exception, their vehicles were negative ground, which has now become the industry standard.
This means that the truck was originally hooked up with the + terminal of the battery connected to the chassis/engine ground, and the - terminal of the battery connected to the starter and every other electrical device on the truck via the appropriate switch or relay. The vehicle can be made to run either way, as long as the wiring is set up right and the generator and regulator are also set up for it.
We need to do some detective work to find out which way the truck is now set up to run (someone may have converted it to negative ground, is what I am saying, and we have to determine that).
I advise taking a step by step approach as follows:
1. Put the battery cables on the original way (+ to chassis, - to electrical items) but as you connect the last end of the second cable (which one doesn't matter) with everything turned off in the truck, check to see whether or not there is a spark as you tap the cable end to the connection. If you see a spark, don't connect it yet (we'll come back to this).
2. If there is no spark, go ahead and connect the cables and turn on the headlights - then go look at the ammeter (if the truck has one) and note whether it is reading a charge or a discharge. Probably it doesn't have one, so we'll have to find out another way, but if it does have one, this is the easy way. OR, if it has a voltmeter, see if it is reading below zero, or about right (6.5 volts). If it has no guages, post a "follow up question" to me and we'll find another way to do this.
If the gauge reads correctly ("discharge" from the headlight drain, or upscale on the voltage scale), go to step 3.
If the gauges read backwards (showing a "charge" when the headlights are on, (engine stopped), or showing a voltage less than zero), reverse the battery connections and go back to step 1, but with the battery now hooked up for negative ground ( - to chassis, and + to the electrical system). Then go to step 3.
3. Next, start the engine and monitor the battery voltage with your portable meter as you rev the engine to fast idle. If the charging system is OK, you will see a rising voltage as the generator replenishes the battery after the start - it will keep rising until it gets to about 7.2 volts, if everything is undamaged and hooked up correctly. If the voltage stays steady, and doesn't climb up toward 7.2 volts, the charging system is not working. The truck can still be driven this way during daylight hours, but you will have to "top up" the battery after every trip until you get the charging system repaired. Do NOT leave the vehicle with the battery hooked up, because a common failure mode for a damaged voltage regulator is to drain the battery through the generator windings, which can and often has resulted in the vehicle being destroyed by a nasty underhood fire.
As for what might be wrong with the charging system, that is another very long discussion - but let's get the polarity issue straightend out first, then tackle that issue, OK? My fingers are getting sore!
OK< all the way back to step 1: If, when you tapped the battery cable on the last connection there WAS a spark, do not connect the battery cables yet. Make very sure there is nothing on inside the truck (lights, radio, heater, anything at all). If not, then, find the voltage regulator and remove the wires from it, and tape the ends so they cannot touch anything. Do the same with the generator wires. Now tap the battery connection again - if there is still a spark, there is still something drawing current - look further until you find it, disconnecting things if you have to until there is no spark when you connect the cables. Once you get to that point, hook up the cables and do the tests of step 2 again. If the battery cable makes a spark when you tap it on the connection ONLY when the generator and voltage regulator are hooked up, there is a problem in the charging system, whether it is charging or not. Probably it is going to have to go to a generator shop for service, if you can find one in your area. Don't hook up the charging system in this condition - it could easily lead to an underhood fire. You can drive it that way, as long as you don't use the headlights or drive very far without recharging the battery.
Post a follow up report to me on what you learn from the above tests, and we'll take it the next mile.
Good luck!
After reading the post above I am starting to wonder if I have a similar problem. I have to check with the person who did the 12V conversion on the F100 to find out what they did. I will follow up with a posting here once I find out.
Posted on May 28th 2013
So I was able to continue troubleshooting. After fixing the starter drive (using my welder), I put the starter back on. It fired three to four times and then got stuck. I tried overwriting the solenoid (by bypassing it), no luck.
 |
| 6V original starter |
Step two
Removed the starter again.
After removing it I found out the safety pin holding the spring together came off. I was lucky to pull the whole assembly out without loosing any parts inside the flywheel hole.
|
| showing the original spring -- half busted |
truck for my son for $5.99
I tried "bench testing" the started with a 20A 6V power supply and no sign of kicking the gear. I did a bit more research to find out the starter actually draws about 10 times more power. Something like 1.2KW not 120W.
So I went ahead and put it on the vehicle again for the fourth time. I am getting good at this let me tell you. I secured all the cables with much confidence that everything is ready to go.
... Not so fast cowboy. Not suck luck. Now I can only hear a clicking sound coming from the solenoid.
I ordered a new solenoid today for $12.00 but just to gain more confidence I just overwrote the solenoid (by bypassing it) and the starter sounds good. Yeah... Now I am waiting for the new solenoid so I can move on with this thing.. I will post again when I receive it in.
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